Whether you're just starting out or looking to upgrade your existing tech stack, we delve into the practical considerations, phases, and key focus areas for selecting, implementing, and integrating the right technology into your operations.
We also explore the characteristics of organizations that succeed in rolling out a technology stack, as well as those that fail to do so. Tune in for practical insights and actionable tips that can help your business thrive in the digital age.
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Hosted by Andrew Smallwood and Laura Mac
Featuring Sam Eddinger, Rhianna Campbell, and Kelli Segretto
Produced by Andrew Smallwood, Laura Mac, and Carol Housel
Edited by Isaac Balachandran
Related: Check out the other property management podcasts we recommend for single-family property managers.
Episode Transcript:
Kelli Segretto
The great thing about property management is that each office is truly unique and individual, and so depending on what your needs are, we can find a really tailored approach to find what's best and what works the most efficiently for you and your team. The best Proptech strategy is really the one that you're going to use.
Laura Mac
I want to officially kick off and welcome all of you. Today is a special TWLX bonus session, so our TWLX event is coming up on May 16th. You can register for that now. I will drop the link in the chat, but this is a bonus session for that. It will be released with our TWLX all access content and today is all about the modern property management tech stack and we are going to be talking about expert strategies and insights for building a winning tech stack. So without further ado, I'm going to bring up our moderator for the next hour. We have invited a special guest to Celebrity Moderate today. He's going to introduce himself a little bit. But Sam is a learner. He's curious. He's an engineer by background. He has a a learning mind and he always asks phenomenal questions as a property manager. So we thought, who better to do better than to to ask great questions and get the best information and share some great information from his own best practices. So, Sam, without further ado, can you unmute yourself and introduce yourself? Maybe you can tell us about your tech stack, too, if you don't mind.
Sam Eddinger
Thanks, Laura Mac. I'm not sure I'm a celebrity, but thanks for boosting my ego anyway. So yes, I'm Sam. My favorite tech stack, which I don't think I saw is Lead Simple. That's mine. Sorry. Hands down the temples. My favorite. But yeah. So I’ve been doing property management for about five years and have a process mindset because of my years as an engineer. And so I've delved right into tech stacks, and if you want to hear my full tech stack, it's App Folio, Lead Simple, Property Meld, Rent Check, Tenant Turner, Abodia, you’re probably missing some additional ones. So I have quite a few that I use for all different reasons, but everyone has different reasons to kind of best support what they're trying to do. So that's about me. I don't really want to speak much about me because we have fantastic people that we can ask questions to. Kelli and Rihanna, who help people like all of you property managers to implement tech stacks. They're consultants that are doing great work in this industry. And I want to give them an opportunity to share about tech stacks and things like that as well. So, Kelli, Rihanna, go ahead.
Rhianna Campbell
Kelli, I'll let you introduce yourself.
Kelli Segretto
Alright, I am Kelli Segreto from K Segreto Consulting. I have been in the industry about 20 years, 20 plus years now, which dates me a little bit. But I have a property management business consulting with an emphasis on proptech. So I really leverage technology in offices to help really automate, optimize, and make as many efficiencies as possible in the offices that I work with. Favorite tech stack that just varies way too much. It really depends on the individual needs. The great thing about property management is that each office is truly unique and individual, and so depending on what your needs are, we can find a really tailored approach to find what's best and what works the most efficiently for you and your team. The best Proptech strategy is really the one that you're going to use.
Rhianna Campbell
And I am Rhianna Campbell. I have been in real estate for almost 20 years, mostly in property management, built and sold my own property management company, valued at almost $5 million, in about 2018. I was very tech heavy forward thinking and loved using different technology in everything that we did and that is one thing that I do focus on as a fractional integrator for a number of property management clients in the industry. In addition to that, I also do coaching and I help people really solve some of their problems, both on the tech implementation side of things, but mostly on the operations and human resource side of things.
Sam Eddinger
Thanks, guys. So as you guys can hear, like, I'm not the celebrity; these are the celebrities, so I like to keep it informal. If you have any questions that you specifically would love to answer, please put it in the chat and we will find you and we'll bring you up to ask those questions to Rihanna and Kelli. So without further ado, Kelli, Rihanna, one of you guys can answer this one. Why should PM companies even care about updating their technology stack? Why not continue to be in the antiquated systems with pen and paper folders, beepers, cell phones, fax machines? Why should people try to update and come up with the times?
Kelli Segretto
I love this question because when I started in property management, we were on triple kits and paper and files and I carried a pager, which if you're still doing that, guys, it's time to update efficiency. Really, when it comes down to it, you're trying to run a business that is as efficient and as dedicated to their customer service. If you can get the rest of your automation and your tech stack working for you to where you can really focus on your end user, on your owner and on your resident experiences, that then allows you to really elevate your business and be competitive in a new way in the industry. And it's not only going to be helpful for your business, but required as this industry continues to accelerate and continues to change.
Rhianna Campbell
To add to that, if you guys have heard me talk about stress management in the property management industry, then you know that stress is serious. We have so much on our plates and there are so many different ways that we can make things easier and more efficient for ourselves. If you guys have heard my story, I've talked about how I used to get sick after taxes and processing 1099s by hand. Now you just push a button and 1099s are done for hundreds of units. At the same time. I don't think there's any reason that we should be doing anything manually or by paper anymore. There are just so many advances in technology to make things easier for ourselves. So I think it's time for us to fully embrace tech as much as possible.
Sam Eddinger
Yeah, what I want to just add to that for me also as a PM, the benefit is multifaceted and that in the spirit of this presentation, the Triple Win podcast, it really is a Triple Win to do technology. It can help us as the property management company and if we do it well and we leverage the technology well, we can get better experiences to the residents as well as to the owners. And so that's one of the things that I want to highlight is, is when you have that mindset of using technology, everyone can win. So that's just one other thing that I want to do. So Rihanna, the next question I want to ask you is tell us a story about a recent implementation of a tech stack and how it completely changed a company.
Rhianna Campbell
Yeah, so I am working with a client right now. We are moving into Lead Simple, which is a great software, as you know, and it is so awesome the way that software now integrates with App Folio just makes everything so much more streamlined. That process has been amazing, but one of the things I do want to just kind of bring up during that process that I wanted the client to think about and I want you all to think about as well as again, kind of going back to that Triple Win mentality is this is not just for our benefit. This is not just to make our lives easier and our jobs easier. It's to really be able to reposition our time so that we're focused on value creation. And that value comes in the form of increased communication to our clients. And that is so key, that is so important as we move things forward. So, you know, we're not trying to make things more difficult for our residents or our clients. We're trying to make things easier for them. I know a lot of people like technology because it's user friendly, so think about the user friendliness on the client side. Think about how it affects the resident. Think about the communications that you're sending out. One of the things that we had to do after we did the building portion of the Lead Simple workflows is going back and take a look at all of the email templates that we had created to ensure that they are clear, and concise, because I know that that can be really challenging. And then also taking the opportunity to improve the way that we do things like adding video content, which is I know new for some people, but so simple and easy to consolidate something into a quick three minute video versus writing it out all in email. So just finding ways that we can enhance the way that we're providing services to our clients and our residents while also making things easier for ourselves.
Sam Eddinger
Sounds great. Thank you. Kelli Would you want to share anything about that? A recent implementation that you had that possibly changed a company or something else that you want to share?
Kelli Segretto
And mine's a little bit more extreme. I had a office recently that we took from all paper files and paper file cabinets to completely paperless system, and they moved into a property management software to watch the transformation of what happens when a business takes everything from a very people paper world into a digital world. It's transformational for that business. It's transformational for the clients that they're servicing to have a portal. It's those little things that we take for granted that we've had in the industry for a while that are world changing for someone who hasn't made that step yet. And it's scary and it can be expensive and it can be overwhelming. But whether you're taking a step into a new technology as a property management software, or maybe it's a showing software or task management or pet screening, whatever that piece might be that you're adding to your business, It can be transformational if you can get past that. The busy work, the set up, that cumbersome kind of section that you go through. But to watch this client kind of go from that stress of what am I missing? Because it's on paper somewhere in here to having alerts and notifications and interaction through chat in the owner portal and the tenant portal. It's just it's transformational for their business. And it's so exciting to see our industry continue to take those advances in those steps forward.
Sam Eddinger
Yeah, that really resonated with me. I know that I had that exact thing happen when I started the company. It was all in my brain and I was always anxious I was missing something. And so developing those systems in place so that you can know that it's there just gives you so much stress relief. So thank you for that. So, you know, when we're actually considering doing tech stacks, what are the considerations that you guys would say that a PM company should have to make sure that they're coming up with the right decision? Because we all know that picking a tech stack that ends up being the wrong tech stack, not only is it lost time, lost money, but it also loses in your in your company the concept of, oh, it's another technology. So what are the considerations PM should have to consider what technology stack is right for them? Let's start with Kelli on this one.
Kelli Segretto
What I like to do is normally start with your issues list. Where are your biggest pain points? Because a lot of times what I see is that a property manager will go to a convention and they will meet with a lot of different vendors and they'll come home with five new things that they want to implement tomorrow. And what you really have to do is you have to dive into your issues list, realize what your biggest need is first, and choose the technology that matches that need. Crowdsource talk to your fellow PMs, join mastermind groups, attend these Triple Win live events, network on Facebook, talk to other people, find out what's working for them, what's not working for them, and do your homework. Because when you go down the road of implementing a new piece of tech, there's a lot of time and there's a lot of money and there's a lot of effort that goes into that. You want to make sure that you made the right decision. And so having people who can guide and lead that decision is going to be really helpful for you and your business and making sure that you understand how those technologies play with your existing technologies and the other things that you want to be able to implement. Things like integrations, you know, Lead Simple just announced their automation, their autopilot mode. That's going to work with these certain property management softwares they truly have integrations with. So understanding how those different technologies are going to integrate with your current platforms that you're using or what APIs are available to you before you make a step into a new technology, you really have to step back and see what are my biggest issues? Am I solving those biggest issues and how is it going to play well with the other things that we currently have implemented in our business?
Rhianna Campbell
Yeah, I so agree with the issues list. One of the things that I usually like doing when I first work with a client is I talk to every single employee and find out what their biggest challenges are. I love to hear directly from the people who are working face to face with residents and clients and find out what some of their challenges are in the way that they do things on a day to day basis. And then from there, you can really pull out some of the commonalities that everyone seems to be having and then really talking to a lot of the different tech providers to find out, you know, how they can help you solve that problem. I think one of the big experiments that I did a couple of years ago was I did demos with a bunch of the new property management softwares and the demos are great, but they love to show you all their new features and all the bells and whistles, and they may not be relevant to what you need. At the end of the day, you really need to be able to solve your problems. And so being able to understand what your current software or current situation is not providing you and some of the challenges that you're having and then going to that say, you know, property management software and say these are a list of my challenges. Can you walk me through how this software can help me solve these problems? And that's a more direct approach versus being sold to on all the features that you may not even use. And what I've noticed is most people don't use their software fully. And so some of those bells and whistles that they show you you may not even use. And so really being clear on the things that you do need and understanding what that is so that you can ask those questions upfront and then get the answers that you need.
Kelli Segretto
Yeah, I would just add to that. There is a lot of property management operators that I've seen that have technologies in place that have the capability to do the functionality that they need, but they're just not aware of it. So make sure you look at what you're using first and make sure you're using it to its fullest extent and not adding on a new technology because it's the newest, greatest thing that somebody told you about. Do your homework.
Sam Eddinger
Great. Yeah. So what I want to follow up with that will start with Rihanna on this one. So you talk about issues list and things like that and it's that's more about choosing the technology. But if a company had to implement a new technology, are there things that the company should do outside of issue lists to prepare them for technology?
Rhianna Campbell
Yeah, that's a great question. So as an example, I do have some people who want to move property management softwares and the capabilities aren't necessarily going to translate over from one software to another. I know that there are a lot of property management softwares that are out there that are now available, but the way that you do things in one software is obviously not going to be the way that you do things in another. So having a clear idea of your processes is going to be so helpful for you to be able to say, I want to move this process from, say, one software to another software, and then walking through that before you sign a contract is so essential. And I know that the people that you talked to during those demos aren't necessarily the people who know, but they can bring in additional support so that you know what you're getting into before you translate over, before you actually go through implementation. Moving from one software to another can be so challenging, which is why I think there are so many people who don't change their property management software. But if you don't know what your processes are, it makes things so much more challenging. So make sure that you're documenting your processes and you know what your processes are and how you're doing things before you decide to implement a new software, because I think it's going to help you really reveal problems before you get too far down that path.
Sam Eddinger
Sure. Kelli Do you have anything that you would like to add to that?
Kelli Segretto
I agree. I think if you're if you're moving software from like a property management software to a property management software, you have to clean up your books before you do that. You have to have a clean balance sheet before you can transfer to a new accounting software. If you are thinking about implementing a task management software like Lead Simple, Process Street or Asana or any of those having your process documented on paper first is going to help you prepare for then that process you're going to go through to then digitize that paper version of your daily tasks. There's a lot of depending on the technology that you're implementing, there are steps that you need to take. And it's good to talk to other people who have felt those pain points or talk to a consultant and work with them, because the technologies that are pitching those to you, like Ryan is as mentioned already are not going to necessarily know what those pain points are or that's not really the focus of what their job is to present that information to you. So ask the questions of what do I need to do? Prepare? Who can I talk to? Who are some other people that have implemented recently that I can speak to and get their take? Let me talk to somebody that it went really well in their implementation. Let me talk to somebody that it went really poorly so that I can make sure that I'm coming into this with all of the knowledge possible so that I can have the best experience possible in the best outcome possible.
Sam Eddinger
Yeah, that's great. I know that for me, whenever I'm thinking about implementing technology, it's all of those things. It's talking to my peers, it's coming up with issues, lists and things like that. But I'm always also trying to have have concerns about how it's being perceived by my employees. I know that for me, so many times I've gotten the question, Oh, you're built, you're bringing this technology, you're going to replace me, right? There's a real fear, I think, of people that technology is going to replace them when in reality it just helps them be their highest and best use, right? Like they don't need to write the same emails 17 times, but that's what they're defining their value based on is those number of emails that they send off over and over. And so for me, like the culture side of it's also very important because if you're doing a changing technology to make things easier, bringing to the 21st century, there's a lot of fear, fear throughout. So continuing on that, would you guys say that there's phases to the implementation of a tech stack or is it just a situation where you set it and forget it, never settle it, go with that one.
Kelli Segretto
It's never set it, forget it, but that would be cool. But that's not reality. And I'd rather talk reality than, you know, fantasy land. Yes, there's absolutely phases. You have your pre implementation where you are prepping your team and you're talking about it and you're giving those why statements that everyone's on board before you ever launch any of those pulling together your processes. All of those types of things need to happen in your pre implementation. You then have to pick a designated person who's going to be owner of that technology that then as you implement, they're going to be the expert and they need to have time during that pre phase to become an expert, to get the training, to know the tool so that when questions happen in your office, your team members have a point of contact in office who's going to be able to either give them the answer or find them the answer and then the implementation itself. But then there's always going to be the bugs that you're working out for a period of time, and then the ongoing, the upkeep. This business is always changing. There are always new technologies, there are always new processes, there are always new boards, there are always new team members that are rolling into our businesses. And so we have to be able to know that our processes and our technologies are always going to be fluid and we need to be able to have that mindset that we need to continuously be having that in our process of, you know, how can I make this a little bit better? How many, how can I make my process a little bit better? How can I make that experience for my residents and my owners a little bit better through the things that we're offering?
Sam Eddinger
Right. Brianna, would you like to share anything?
Rhianna Campbell
Yeah, just to add to that, because that's exactly the same thing that comes to mind for me as well. So just to add to that, you know, I think that, you know, your tech stack should be thought of almost like an employee of your company. You need to be constantly monitoring their performance. And I think that sometimes we tend to expect that things will just keep working and not really do the work that we need to monitor performance. And what does that look like for your employees? How do you monitor their performance? Do you do it on an annual basis? Do you actually talk to them every month? Do you talk to them every quarter? What do you need to do in order to ensure that things keep working and working really well? So if you were having like an annual review for your employee, you would do the same thing for your tech. Is your tech still up to speed? Are they still meeting your needs as you grow and as you change and as you morph and as you add new employees or remove employees, does that technology still work for you? And really being able to evaluate whether or not that technology is working is really important. I've seen a number of times where people buy into the tech and then don't use it. So really having points in time where you check to see if you're really utilizing that software that you paid a lot of money for and not just spending money on it every month. And that can happen sometimes too. So just making sure that you are creating some opportunities to evaluate the performance of your technology to make sure that it's keeping up with the demands and the changes of your organization is so key.
Sam Eddinger
And that's why I think NARPM and just being part of masterminds is so important because, you know, so many people don't realize the new things that are coming out that could change in revolutionary ways, like Lead Simple, right, is doing for process software. So Karen has a fantastic question. So I'm going to ask this for you guys, our esteemed panelists. How do you make that experience for the old timers, the owners who have been with you several years and know introducing them to new technology? How do you make that a good experience?
Rhianna Campbell
Yeah, that is that is.
Kelli Segretto
It’s a hard question. Go ahead, Rhianna.
Rhianna Campbell
So, you know, it's always challenging to adapt to new things for everybody and not just people who are older, but what I have found is it's not from lack of desire to want to use technology. It's really from comfort of doing the thing that they are used to doing, the way that they're used to doing it. And so when someone's comfortable doing things the way that they're used to doing it, then that just probably means they need more training than everybody. Some people are more adaptable than others. And so the people who are not adapting to technology or need a little bit more support probably need some ongoing training and support during the transition and also after. They're not going to always be as quick to adjust to new updates and ways of doing things. And again, it's not because they don't want to, it's because they just need more support and a little bit more hand-holding. So I would say make sure that you provide different levels of training and support for anyone when you're implementing new technology or new ways of doing things, new processes into your organization.
Sam Eddinger
Great. Thank you. Kelli, would you like to share?
Kelli Segretto
Yeah, I would just add to that a great example of that. When I was doing property management in the San Francisco Bay Area, we went from literally triplicate and all paper to Yardi Voyager 7 S. And so that transition for our owners and for our tenants was a very big deal and it caused a lot of anxiety. And so what I've seen a lot of people do, especially in this world where even more tech is going after or being able to create communication pieces between owners and tenants and the property manager. I think giving your owners and tenants a little bit of grace is really important and understanding that what they're trying to follow along with you and come on this journey with you is a hard thing. Sometimes it's not as simple as sending an email anymore that says, Hey, we've made a change. You do have to provide coaching. You do have to provide a little bit more information. That's where those Loom videos come into play, of giving them example, having step by step instruction guides as well, and approaching it from a way that you are teaching on multiple different levels because different people learn different ways. And so I like to have a training video that is under 3 minutes long and a supporting text document that has pictures and boxes and arrows and step by step instructions. And if they still are having trouble, have them come into your office and spend the 5 minutes to show them how to access their portal or how to make a payment or whatever they need to do. I think our tech partners are doing great of making it as easy as possible. We just now need to be careful in how we present that to our clients.
Sam Eddinger
Yeah, it was interesting recollection recently. You know, I'm starting to get a little older and might not look like it yet, but TikTok is, you know, Bom Bom, Loom, you know, all these new technologies and, and I'm getting to a point where I don't want to learn them like SEO and the world is changing, right? And so and to some level, you know, it used to be like, I don't understand these older people and why they just can't get with it. But now that I'm becoming a little bit older, I get it. Like, I don't want to learn about Snapchat and I don't I just want to get it my way. So like, that's that's a very real thing that's going on and we want to be sensitive to it. So I love your guys statements because to some level, what I, what I explain to my coworkers is to pare it back how they communicate with you. So if they send you emails, email back, if they send you a phone call, call back, if they send you a text message, text back. But, you know, if you if they call and you text an email, they're not going to be as happy because they've already told you what they want. They want a phone call. Right. So to some level, you know, try to provide it to them. Still a great level of service, but try to respond to them in the way that they're responding to you. And I think you'll have a lot of success.
Kelli Segretto
So to do that real quick, I had a property manager once that they did a color test for every single one of their new owners and every single one of their new tenants. And then that went into their property management file of this person's a red personality, this person's a yellow personality, so that they knew how best to communicate, and then asking those simple questions of onboarding, of how best would you like to be communicated with, oftentimes gives you that opportunity to make sure that you're meeting them where they're at.
Sam Eddinger
All right, let's go let's go to the other spectrum. So we went to the people that don't want to change. What about the people that want to change like crazy? So Jim has a chat about artificial intelligence. What and how do you see actual implementation of AI within our real world daily activities today? What do you think is going to be disruptive that's going to even revolutionize the technologies even more.
Rhianna Campbell
Well, I'll tell you how I'm using it now. So I again, talking about the Lead Simple transition, going through all the communications that we're sending out to clients and owners. You can run that through ChatGPT and see what comes out and really evaluate whether or not the communication is better than the communication that you were going to send. And we're just going to pick and choose which pieces of those communications you want to be able to use. But I think it cleans up language a little bit and it does help. And so that's an easy, I think, way of integrating artificial intelligence into the way that we're already doing things in a way that, again, just kind of streamlines things. Now, obviously, this is a project you're moving into a new software application and so you're going to do this one time during the implementation phase of things, but you may not necessarily use ChatGPT everytime you want to send an email communication to a client or a resident. But this is the way that I'm using the tech right now, and I found it pretty helpful.
Kelli Segretto
I think there's a lot that is happening right now. I know ChatGPT is kind of the big thing that most people are talking about. You've even got companies like Process three that is infusing a component of ChatGPT that you can put a prompt into ChatGPT and it will actually create your process for you all of the steps within your process. So we're seeing it further than the right this email for me or create my social media post blurb or those types of things are kind of low hanging fruit of what people are starting with. But as this gets more and more intelligent and as they clean out more of the kinks, and anyone who's spent 10 minutes working in ChatGPT, you tweak your prompt a little bit and what comes out is a little bit better and then you tweak it again. What comes out is a little bit better. The more that we learn how to work with the AI and more that the more that the AI gets distinguished and ready for mass consumption. A lot of those customer service communications won't be a live person anymore. I think a lot of that is going to be taking care of. Those chat bots aren't really that great yet, but they will be. I think we're going to see a lot of marketing. You're even seeing coding, so integrations between platforms can be easier. There's just so much possibility when you're looking at the AI world and I think it's going to really change the industry in a lot of ways over the next couple of years.
Sam Eddinger
Yeah, so I agreed with all of that and so I know how I'm using it as well already. Like so one of the things that I do is with post, we can basically get a prompt answer to the answer. The audience I think, or whatever, you can look up different questions. That is being asked about property management and then you can ask ChatGPT to answer that question and then you can put it in the teleprompter app and you can make videos and you can do all sorts of things very efficiently. I think the point of all these technologies is to always remember how we can have our people do their highest and best use, right? So emails used to be one of the highest and best use, writing it a single time and writing a great templated email that you can you can run forever and spending hours on it to make sure you get just right. Like now we can possibly use ChatGPT to automate it. And now instead of actually writing it from scratch, we're editing it. Instead of having to spend a lot more time and effort on it. So that's one way I think ChatGPT, at least right now, is going to really distort or get rid of copywriting in a significant way. I think blogs are gonna be a dime a dozen, but do it right now because it's a low hanging fruit and you can really utilize the technology. I think a lot of the really creatives with respect to branding, hey, I got my brand behind me, I can write that a couple of times. I want an ironclad property management. I want you to make it in the style of Jackson Pollock, right? So, you know, you can do all sorts of things like that. It can really be creative about things that you can do, and now you don't need to pay someone for it. But but Kelli's right, too. I mean, even things with process, I know that the API integration, there's some people in our industry that are doing things like, you know, put doing property marketing descriptions and, you know, putting in some things creatively. We're thinking about doing things about like, you know, here's some prompts from an upset owner and now we can basically respond to them with an email. We can review. So it does it so it makes the the necessity of a really high skilled, educated employee. You don't need them as much. They can focus on doing other tasks that are more value added. So those are some things that I see with the AI and I think there's a lot more that's going to come. I think it's it is one of the disruptive technologies that are coming in the next 20 years, if not sooner, in this case. So can I.
Rhianna Campbell
Just can I add one more thing to that?
Sam Eddinger
Yeah, please.
Rhianna Campbell
So, you know, one of the things that I feel like we learned from COVID and being in the pandemic is that there were some of our peers who are ready in advance because they were already virtual, they already work remotely, they didn't have an office. And so there were a number of people, a good chunk of us, that had to adapt to a new way of doing things. And then there were some of us that were already great. I mean, nothing really changed for them. And in thinking about AI and the fact that it's coming and we know that it's coming, you know, I know it always feels challenging to be an early adopter, but these are the times where everybody's playing with it and no one knows how to use it. And it's also the easiest time to start to adopt it a little at a time without it feeling overwhelming. So, you know, obviously, you know, we don't know how this tech is going to evolve, but just really being able to play with it a little bit will help ease the transition into a future that we already know is coming.
Sam Eddinger
Yeah, I agree with that wholeheartedly. So, you know, it's coming. You know, you're either adapting to the times or you're not. Right. And I love that. And I love the term that you said there, Rihanna. You said a culture of adapting. Right. And I think that really summarizes for me at least as a successful tech stack implementation is do you have a culture of adapting or do you not? Right. And so we'll talk about that. Curtis had a question about our opinions on copyright laws. And unfortunately, Curtis, that's a way above my pay grade. Like that's going to be adjudicated probably at the Supreme Court level. And so I really won't be able to to do that in an educated way. I just know that, you know, tools are tools, and how we respond to those tools in our tech stacks will really separate who is going to be successful in the next generation versus who is going to be left behind. So with respect to that culture of adapting, so based on your experiences and maybe this is loaded, can you guys predict when you think an implementation of a technology stack is likely to succeed and or fail? And what are the characteristics of ones that maybe you think would succeed? And maybe one of the characteristics of an organization that you think would actually fail? I will start with Kelli on this one.
Kelli Segretto
I think that the biggest indicators that I've typically seen, I've seen hundreds of businesses launch technology across the nation and helped them implement technology across the nation. And the ones that tend to fail are the ones that are not prepared. And what I mean by not prepared is they don't have their teams buy in. They don't even know what they really want the technology for. They just feel like they want it and they want it right now. They're not willing to dedicate a resource of a person that's going to own it to implement it in their office without that owner, without that ownership, tech fail, new technology being implemented in the office. And so it's a lack of preparedness, it's a lack of dedication, and it's a lack of being willing to put in the work and the time. If you're too busy and you are running like a crazy person, you're not able to get even your daily tasks done. It's not time to implement technology. Hire a person to help take off that load, give you the breathing room so that then you can focus and have somebody dedicated to focusing on bringing in that new technology that's going to make your life so much easier. Those that succeed are the ones that really are prepared, are willing to do the work and choose that key person that's going to be the owner of that process in their in their office. It's really about your mentality and what you're bringing to it and less about the technology that you're implementing. It's easy to blame it on the technology. It's not the technology's fault.
Sam Eddinger
Yeah, I think that more often than not that's the case, right? So something doesn't happen. Well, and oh, the technology just didn't work well enough. Right. Because really it's a reflection of our own internal insecurities and our own internal failings. Right. And a lot of us don't want to admit the fact that we were the reason why something failed. Right? That's human nature. What I want. Rihanna, What would you like to share about ways that you can predict if an implementation will be successful or possibly a failure?
Rhianna Campbell
Yeah, I'm just to add to Kelli's point about buy in, I think that some of the challenges that I've seen where things don't go well is because there is a very top down approach to bringing on technology. I think that there needs to be a conversation that happens from everybody on the team that really is able to contribute to that conversation. On whether or not we should actually bring that technology in-house. I think that there are challenges that people have on the team and they have their own approach or have their own ideas on what can be helpful for them and have everyone have an opportunity to really test out the technology and see if it's going to work for them individually. I think that there is definitely a again, kind of going back to culture. It's a cultural approach to things, it's a cultural approach to solving problems. It's let's get everybody involved and let's figure things out. And I know that's a lot slower and it's easier for me to as a leader just say, this is what we're doing and we're going to pull the trigger on April 1st and we're going to start this on Q2, but that's not going to get the buy in and the end result is usually not going to be great. So it's better to kind of move slowly and get the buy in at the front end from everyone who's going to be involved in using that software and have everybody have an opportunity to give their feedback on what they think is going to make their jobs easier. And you can create some timelines for that so that it doesn't drag out too long. But everybody needs to be involved in the thought process, whether or not that's going to help them to solve their problems. And if you don't get that on the front end, it is really hard to drag people along on the back end. Once you start the implementation process.
Sam Eddinger
Yeah, that reminds me of my time as an engineer. We had so many things that got implemented and they're like, Yeah, you're going to do this. And it never worked well, bogged down our computers and we're just we it was, it was almost like a meme. It's like, oh, another implementation, right? Another implementation. So I think that's so true. Get one done, get some champions to do it and you will have more success. So I think I want to bring Jonathan up. He's got a good question about overlapping texts and I'm not sure I can answer this one. Well, so Laura, Matt, can you bring Jonathan up since we love talking to Jonathan? Anyway, so I'm gonna let you ask our esteemed guests this question.
Jonathan
Thank you, Sam. I appreciate it. Hey, Kelli, hey Rihanna.
Jonathan
Long time no see. Kelli We were talking, like, an hour ago, but so have either of you guys ever run into, like, overlapping tech and seen How do you use both? Years ago, when I was at I know there was at one point we were using both Z inspector and rent check. They both have similar implementation models. They both work very similarly. They both operate in a lot of the same capacity. But we used both for different purposes because we were in a mindset at one point of just select all of the tech that we can figure out which ones we like and then discard the ones we don't is like and that was at a point that we were growing at a rate that was crazy. And so that sort of thing was I don't think it was the most effective way to do that, but I'm honestly not sure of a way to do that better. I know it would be impossible to do with property management software, although weirdly, at the same time we were both using two separate property management softwares as well. A whole separate shebang. But but what is what is a good way other than just doing demos? Because we all know a demo is never enough. It's not it doesn't matter which software it is. I've never been in a demo where I was like, Boom, this is sold me completely. You have to get in it and use it. But how do you figure out which one is the best without spending years operating in a subpar tech suite?
Kelli Segretto
So I have done a lot of this when I worked at PMI, when I worked at real property management, You know, part of my job to take technology platforms and vet them and then decide what one was going to be best to implement across the brand. And so one of my favorite ways to really get an idea of how that tool functions is ask for a sandbox. Ask for a sandbox to where you can actually play with it, manipulate it, break it, find where those weaknesses are in that software before you commit to it, because it is really hard to just take a sales person's word for it. They're going to tell you all the great stuff. They're going to tell you all the things that are in their pipeline and all these wishes and hopes and dreams, and that's their job. Good on them for doing it. They do a phenomenal job at that. But the reality is I need to know how it's going to work for me in my business day to day today, not how is it going to work for me in three months when you hopefully launch that new piece of the product and so you using a sandbox and really digging in, but then also asking for those actual referrals and actually contacting not just your best experience, but I want to talk to one or two people that had a poor experience or that recently left you, because I want to know what is the nitty gritty that people aren't talking about. And maybe it is a miscommunication, but at least I know that I've done as much due diligence as possible. I don't like overlapping software because what you then typically end up doing is using pieces of this one and pieces of that one and not really going deep enough into either to know whether or not either one of them could suit all of your needs without the other. And so sandboxing seems to be the best way I've been able to really dive deep enough to understand that platform.
Jonathan
That is a really good way to look at that. I've never I've never asked for a sandboxing experience.
Rhianna Campbell
I mean, this is the first time I've heard about sandboxing. I'm like, I'm going to sandbox all the time.
Jonathan
I want to sandbox everything.
Kelli Segretto
We'll do a sandbox together Jonathan.
Jonathan
Yes let's do it.
Kelli Segretto
Room 22, Sandbox.
Jonathan
Room 22 for life. You know, I'm so upset that I'm not wearing my shirt. It's in my the kids wear it to sleep in because it's so comfy. It's a long story everyone else that's in here. Sorry, guys.
Sam Eddinger
So a couple other related questions on that. When you're when you're working with people and trying to provide consulting services and you I assume you start to learn more about the culture and you learn more about what would really help the company be successful, do you make recommendations based on your experience with software? How do you go about trying to identify what you think would be the right software for your clients? And let's start with Rihanna, since Kelli Just answer the other one for Jonathan
Rhianna Campbell
Yeah, So I mean, just a number of different things. First of all, you know, how adaptable is the team to ideas of adding in new software tools? Are they using something currently that's not working for them? And you can recommend something that would work better for them. I think that there's just so many different scenarios of which to offer, you know, different recommendations. But if I see an obvious problem, especially a common problem between a number of the different staff members, and I can recommend something that I think can solve that problem, then what I'll usually do is say, you know, I think you should check this software out. I think this can solve a number of different people's problems. Having used so many different softwares and so many different places, like I've seen how they function when they are doing really well, when people are using utilizing them and and really maxing them out. So I can see how well they could work. It just really takes some time to get there. And so I do kind of prepare them for, you know, it's not going to be great at the beginning. But I think overall long term, that'll be a great fix for some of their problems. So usually I just have to gauge the different employees and the different issues that they have and then make recommendations from their.
Sam Eddinger
Kelli, what about you?
Kelli Segretto
Yeah, I start with a discovery call with the team and go through and really understand what the tech stack is that they're using currently. If they're using a tech stack at all. I've had a number of clients that this is all new to them and then really understanding the ins and outs of how they work on a day to day basis, What is their communication look like? What does their interaction look like with their clients? What does their process look like? Do they have a documented process? There's a lot of different questions that we kind of go through to discover where they're at, and then we develop that issues list and the whole team has an input into that issues list to be able to say, Hey, these are the things that are really concerning us. And then you look forward to commonalities and really figure out what's going to be the best piece to implement First. And so I think it's it's part of a larger strategy. Typically, it goes into a full business strategy and an implementation plan to where you have an action plan that will phase in which technologies you're going to add. And the timing of those thinking about seasonality of your business. Also, you don't want to be starting up your new technology in the middle of the summer. Sorry, guys, I know it would be super helpful, but it's also going to be super cumbersome to try to implement that the middle of the year. And so we're taking into consideration portion your team's bandwidth in addition to your team's needs, and then creating a long term strategy to put that action plan into place to really help it make sure that you're not just implementing these things, but your team is seeing wins along the way, which further creates that commitment and that buy in. As you go through that implementation process, you have to celebrate those little wins.
Sam Eddinger
Right, For one question on that, Kelli. So I think you said or maybe as Rihanna said about so many people, they're just they ask for help because the fact that they're so in the weeds and every little thing and and they can't they can't even spend time working on the business. So they say, oh, a tech staff will save me. Right. So how do you so is the first stage in that process like, what does that look like? How do you advise them to get to the point where they can even start thinking about implementing a tech stack?
Kelli Segretto
Yeah, they have to either decide that they can create the bandwidth for themselves. So sometimes that's longer hours, that's evening hours, that's your weekends, that's taken away your holidays, or sometimes it's to either hire an RTM or an in-person employee before you start looking at a tech stack, depending on what your workload is. If you're running a property management business and you've got 150 doors and you're doing everything yourself today, it is probably a better strategy to hire first and then step into a tech stack implementation. Or maybe it's a baby step of a tech stack implementation and it's itself showing software. It's a piece that really isn't that hard to get started, but will take some of that bandwidth off of you. So then you're also looking at, you know, if I am a single operator or I'm one or two people, I can then decide whether or not I have the bandwidth or whether there are ways that implementing that tech, is the tech going to also equal the time. So implementing self showing, if 50% of my time is because I'm running around showing properties all day, then yes, that's going to make sense to implement that technology. But is implementing a process component going to be the best bang for your buck when you're a single operator? Probably not. So it's a matter of the right timing for your business. Also.
Sam Eddinger
I love that. Rihanna, anything else you want to share on that specifically?
Rhianna Campbell
I completely agree. I think, you know, as leaders, we have to make time for the things that are important. And I think sometimes because we're firefighting, we're running around with our heads cut off most of the time. And it can be really challenging to figure out how to prioritize things. But if we want to move our business in the right direction, we have to make time for it. And really being able to figure out how we can carve out that time is so important. So whether you do, you know, an hour a day to just even think about how you're going to move things in the right direction, whatever it takes for you to actually carve out some time is so necessary in the same day, in the same way that we want to take care of ourselves right. It's so easy to put other things and other people ahead of us, but we really need to make the time to really think about what we need to do in order to be better and move things in the right direction. Otherwise, we're always going to be running around in chaos. We just need to take the time to do it.
Sam Eddinger
Yeah, I mean. Sorry, go ahead, Kelli.
Kelli Segretto
I would just say that's that's one of the biggest things is you have to stop and make time to work on your business instead of working in your business day in, day out, the time's never going to come. You have to carve out the time. You have to be dedicated to it, and you have to be disciplined in putting that on your calendar and making it sacred. That's your time to work on your business.
Sam Eddinger
Sure. So I love that the whole culture of adapting, but sometimes we just you know, it's not just about firefighting and adapting and rolling with the punches, but carving out that time. So one other quick question. I know we're we're getting to the end of this. There's a couple of different pervasive philosophies, at least with PMS, which is to go best in class and or low hanging fruit. I know one of the things that I like to do, especially with the vendors that I use, is find out which vendors have a culture of exceptional customer service. As property managers, we get punched in the face every single day by tenants, by owners, by vendors that let us down. And so we want to make sure that we have vendors that are going to be able to build us up and be responsive and successful. So with that said and that caveat also with best in class, do you guys do that? You do you recommend best in class? Do you recommend trying to do you know, softwares also that maybe aren't quite as good but make it so that you have more tech stacks? Because I know I have six or seven and a lot of people only want to have three. So how do you recommend how do you recommend those things? Let's start with Rihanna on that one.
Rhianna Campbell
Yeah, I love industry specific software. People who know the single family rental industry, people who are dedicated to our industry because they're their fingers on the pulse of what the needs are for this industry. So I love when they come out with new software options updates kind of talking again about like Lead Simple versus process street process Street is, you know, not dedicated specifically to single family rentals. So the updates that they have are going to be to a broader audience and not necessarily for our industry. So I love when there are very industry specific software options that are available to us that we can start to use in our businesses every day, because that's really, I think, going to make a huge difference in the as as technology advances. That's really going to help us to keep up with the times.
Kelli Segretto
I try to make sure that I'm staying up to date on all of the technologies that are available that can work. And so whether that is diving deep into Lead Simple or process free, because you have to remember that property managers often times are property managers, not because as a teenager they decided they wanted to be a property manager. And so they went into the field and they've been doing this the whole time. Know a lot of times property managers come from different lives and they come from different experiences, whether they're an engineering background or they owned a tire shop or, you know, whatever their life may have brought them to this point, different technologies are going to be a better fit for different people. And so, yes, you have to have technologies that are going to play well with the other technologies because nobody wants to have 15 different technologies. They have to learn. No one does. That's not sustainable. So you do have to be able to make sure that you have the proper AI integrations, APIs, all of those types of things, so that things can communicate with one another. But what I found is that personality a lot of times will dictate what is best for that company and for that business. And so making sure that I stay up to date on a vast variety and not just those that show up to the conferences. I'll I'll look at technologies. I'll regularly just Google search what are the top technologies for this and then learn those technologies so that I know how they compete. It also helps us be a better partner to our vendors to be able to say, Hey, I saw this feature in this other platform that I thought was really cool. Would you guys consider integrating that into your. And so we're helping our industry partners get better too. And I think as an industry and a whole my whole purpose in life right now is to elevate the standards of property management. And if I can help both my clients and my vendor partners and, you know, everyone who supports this industry elevate what we're offering, that's a better experience for the owners and the residents. And that's really what it's all about. We are a service industry. This is an industry about people. And so whatever, whatever is going to fit the flavor of that person and their business and is going to work the best for them, that's typically what I'll recommend. But have a whole card stack of things that I can recommend for people.
Sam Eddinger
That's awesome. All right. Well, we're we're coming up to the end of our time. So last thing I want to ask you, Italian, Rihanna, anything that you want to add and or words of encouragement to the PMS that are thinking about doing tech stack improvements, enhancements.
Rhianna Campbell
Rihanna, be patient. I know that this is a huge undertaking and can be very stressful and very challenging. You know, I think that sometimes we want to see instant results too, and that's not always the case. It just takes time. So you go into this with mindset of patience so that you know that it's going to take some time for you to really see how things will evolve as you adapt to the technology that you're going to implement. So that would be my one one piece of advice.
Sam Eddinger
Thanks, Rihanna And you, Kelli.
Kelli Segretto
I think patience is a is a great a great trait to come into this with. I would also say don't be afraid. I think a lot of times technology is daunting and it is overwhelming. And take a step back from it and look at it from, you know, a bird's eye view instead of a street view so that you can see the whole picture of where you want to go, but you can break it into smaller chunks that makes it more manageable. The more manageable you make implementing a technology, the less stressful it feels. And give yourself time and grace. It's it's going to take time, whatever amount of time you think it's going to take, do it because it's going to take time for you to really integrate these different wonderful technologies into your business.
Sam Eddinger
I love that so much. Thank you guys so much. Laura Mac, do you want to exit us?
Laura Mac
Awesome drop some love for the panel in the chat. Everybody just say thank you. Say what you learned. Give a nice applause. So appreciate everyone's time. So appreciate the insights. Happy Wednesday. Happy Triple Winsday.
Andrew Smallwood
That's all for today's Triple Win Property Management podcast. Thank you so much for listening. Thank you so much for sharing a piece of your life with us. We do not take it for granted. I also want to give a shout out to Carol Housel for everything she and her team does to make these possible. It's crazy to think about, over 5000 professional Property Managers have pressed play on episodes and season one and season two now, and we really want to encourage you to keep giving feedback because more and more people are listening. It's getting better and better and better thanks to everything that you're sharing with us. If you liked this enough to listen, I want to encourage you to share it with other people. You can give us feedback directly on the social media channels, Facebook, LinkedIn, wherever you're hanging out. You can also send us an email at TripleWin@SecondNature.com. And we just want to give more! There's no sales pitch here, just want to offer more resources that help you find and stack your next Triple Win and become a Triple Win driven Property Manager. So where can you find that? You can find a private Facebook group. You can find our blog, you can find our newsletters to find more resources all at RBP.SecondNature.com to search for what you're looking for there. And every time we see you, we want to see a better version of you and your business. To that end, keep it going, feel inspired. Take our encouragement and we'll see you next time.
Get ready to turbocharge your business with the latest tech trends in Property Management. In this episode, we explore the essential ingredients for setting your business up for success with technology. Sam Eddinger of Ironclad PM interviews our expert guests Rhianna Campbell (Proper Planning LLC) and Kelli Segretto (K Segretto Consulting) as they share real-life case studies and examples of how companies have leveraged technology to achieve better business outcomes.